Gospel-Centered Pro-Life Podcast
Gospel-Centered Pro-Life Podcast

Episode 129 · 10 months ago

Counter Intuitive Things We Have Learned

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Over the years in being involved in sidewalk ministry we’ve had some experiences that taught us that what we previously believed was incorrect. In this episode we want to share a few of those things and offer some encouragement and Biblical insights to help equip you.

I think this, as far as our tone can really be a manifestation of what's in our hearts. And so if you show up at the abortion center on a consistent basis and you've got an angry tone, you've got an accusatory tone, I think it's time to get in the presence of the Lord and see if there's some things in my heart, Lord that I need to get right with you. I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours, and me, Lord, I am yours, I am yours. I'm welcome to the Gospel Center Pro Life Podcast, a podcast designed to equip, encourage and challenge you in pro life ministry and always were the focus on the Gospel. Stay tuned. I felt show passish, touch your heart. Use Me. Welcome back to the Gospel centered pro life podcast. Appreciate you guys joining us and this is being recorded in two thousand and twenty one, actually the ladder days, the latter days of two thousand and twenty one, but should come out in the early days of two thousand and twenty two. So we hope that you guys had a blessed Christmas. Hope you guys had a blessed New Year and we hope that this podcast episode will be an encouragement to you as we speak from some experiences, some of the things that we've learned. And that's going to be the title of this maybe maybe I'll twee the title a bit before I put it out there, but this is kind of the title we're rolling with as we're recording this. counterintuitive things we have learned, right, and we may need to break down what that means, because I don't really know what the word counterintuitive means. Oh dear, okay, well, we'll try and educate everybody that. Yeah, actually, not just Daniel. Yeah, I'm not as dumb as some people think. It's that don't know what that means. So we're going to talk about some of the things that we've learned over the years, some of the things counterintuitively, some of the things you think, hmm, maybe you should do this, maybe you should do that, but you find actually that's not very productive. It's counter productive right, and so things that you would think are one way we're thinking. We've learned those things are a little different. So some of these points are going to be counterintuitive and some of them maybe you're going to just be common sense. For you. Right, but it's things that we learned nonetheless, and we hope that, rather than making your own mistakes on the sidewalk, you can let us make them for you and you can learn learn from us. What do you think about that? I think it's good. In fact, the first point that we're going to make as a mistake that I made, I think, just a few days ago. I've been out here for nine years. So sometimes we don't learn from our Vicki, I don't make mistakes, they're just happy accidents. Oh, okay, yes, that's what. What's the gay? The painter with the Oh, with the big Afro? Yeah, I can I remember his name. I don't remember...

...it. Bob Something. See, then, this is how sm where we are. And he said you just make happy accidents. So okay, yeah, let's lead to it. So we'll turn some of our happy accidents, some of our mistakes, into teaching moments for all of you guys. That's right. And you guys can maybe shoot me an email and let me know what that guy's name is. Who I should know absolutely. It is what I'm in. It's Bob someone. Yeah, it is, but I can't think of it right now. So maybe by the end of this episode I'll just chime in and say this is the guys name. Me and my kids used to watch that guy together. I used to watch him. Anyway, that's not what this podcast is about. It's about sidewalk ministrying. So let's go through. What are some of the counterintuitive things that we've learned, or maybe some of the common sense things that we've learned over the years that we feel like would help and encourage people that are involved in this ministry. Yeah, well, I'll tell you the little story that led to the first point that we're going to make, which is that the importance of timing is critical. Yeah, speaking to Tommy. Oh what Bob Ross? But yes, yeah, that's the guys name. Okay, you're absolutely correct about my timing. Could have been better on that, because you're trying to make a point here and I just chimmed in for something that has nothing to do with what you're saying. Yeah, so it was the right thing, but at the wrong time, which is exactly which is exactly the point. So the little story is a person stopped car side, in fact two in a row stopped car side up the street, which doesn't happen all that often, but it was my lucky day and both of them were willing to engage, at least for a little while. Yeah, and the first one, I talked with her for a little while and then it felt like it was time to say, what would God have you do? And at that moment she nudged her boyfriend in the side and say get out of here. Yeah, and and drove it into the abortion center. You would think I would have learned after after that. But then the next car comes along and the very different. That woman was already crying. She pulled over, she wouldn't look at me. She was with another woman and she's looking straight ahead and she's obviously very upset. I just said, look, you don't want to do this. It's very clear that you don't want to do this, and she was listening and I started telling about our resources and, in my defense, at that moment one of the pro abortion people came running over, screaming at her to drive in on into the abortion center, and you could tell she was like getting tense, getting plustered, and so kind of as a last resort, because I thought I'm going to lose her anyway. She's about to drive away because of this pro abortion person telling her to do so. So I said again, what would I asked? I had already asked her, do you believe in the Lord? She nodded, and then I said, well, what would God have you do? As the PROPORT is standing there screaming at...

...her, and she she looked like she was about to choke back really choke back sobs and then drove forward and I saw her slow down. I thought she was going to keep going and she ended up turning into the abortion center. So I just really I don't beat myself up. I realized that the Holy Spirit needs to do his thing and and I do my thing, which is obedient to his call, and I do my best at the moment. But I do analyze in both those cases, should I have held off? It was the timing of that statement not quite the right time? Should I have paused, told more about the resources, talked more about the grief that, especially with the second one, right, that she was clearly feeling. And so the the first thing is we all need to be aware of the timing. You can say the right thing at the wrong time and have it be counter productive. Yeah, yeah, I know. Just for you guys listening. I do want to strongly discourage you from walking on eggshells and always being fearful that you're going to say the wrong thing at the wrong time. Right, to speak God's word and really to put the results in God's hands is what we've always taught you, guys, what we've always encourage you speak the truth of God's word, put the results in God's hands. However, there there is timing. They're in every situation can be different too. So that's why I'm you know, I'm not going to give you. We're not going to be able to give you. Here's the perfect time to say this. Here's a perfect time to say that. I think probably more than anything, just knowing that timing does matter. Right as that, if you're you're in the kind of the chain of a conversation, stringing one thought to another, thought to another thought, that it's really best for us to hold back those kind of stinging statements for kind of the very last yeah, I think that's probably timing. There's a scripture here that comes to mind. I quote it off and actually, you guys, if you've listened to this podcast or an amount of time, you've probably heard me quote this so proverbs twenty seven, verse fourteen, he who blesses his friend with a loud voice, rising early in the morning, it will be counted a curse to him. So it's talking about the blessing, like you want to bless your friend. It's like going to your friend's house at four o'clock in the morning, I love you, you're my best friend, and with all the love that you have for your friend in your heart, saying this loudly early in the morning. So the loud voice, the timing, early in the morning, Oh that's not that's a no Goo for your friend. He's going to receive it as a curse. You're cursing him actually, even though your intentions are well and so I think again, rather than just walking on eggshells and always being fearful, because this is one of the things that keeps people from the sidewalk is they're afraid they're going to say the wrong thing or something. So we don't want any of that. But I think what we do, would encourage you...

...guys to be doing, is to analyze, like if you say something and it has a particular effect, let's let's say you say, what would God have you to do? And you see a consistent pattern of it just shuts the conversation down, then it's probably good to reassess should I be saying that particular thing at that time. Yeah, I do think that's a good statement. I do think what we gotta have you to do. To me, it's it's, in my mind at least, one of those statements that kind of last minute before they're going into the door of the abortion center, that I'm going to give out what would God have you to do, because it will hopefully provoke in them the fault of really what God have be doing by doing what honors the Lord in those car side scenarios. For me personally, I want to try to be as relational as possible. I want to be as much of obviously bringing God into the conversation right off the bat. This idea that we don't mention God, we don't mention religion or Jesus until like the very last is absurd. Okay, we should mention Jesus. He's on the forefront of their minds. We're talking what they're already thinking, because even if they don't believe in God, they're still thinking about what God really wants them to do. Yeah, but making it more relational rather than just because in reality that statement is more of an accusation than it is really a question. That question is really a statement of accusation that it really is a question, although we hope that it provokes thought and a response, not just to US really, but to themselves, between them and God, you know. Yeah, so again, don't want you guys to be fearful of saying the wrong thing, but just reflective of what could be, as far as timing is concerned, the right time to say whatever it might be. Yeah, yeah, and actually our second point, which is about adoption. Most of these points are things that we hear from New People and frequently they'll say, do you ever talk about adoption? Yeah, Oh gee, we never thought of it. Wow, because I bad you came along and mention that, because we never thought about talking about adoption. But overwhelmingly the timing of when you mentioned adoption. It's not that we never mentioned it, but it is a it's a conversation shopper, especially if it's early on in the conversation, if you have exhausted everything and they've said, I did have one mom who we came to this point and she just said, I just don't want this baby, I cannot parent this baby. Yeah, well then, I then I brought up adoption. It was still an no. She didn't take me up on it so at all. And and I don't know that I can remember even a single person ever that I know of that I've personally counseled who has chosen adoption. Yeah, so, knowing that the timing and the mentioning of adoption is usually a conversation stop her dead. Matter of fact, if you want one thing that would stop your conversation dead in its tracks for the most part, then mention adoption right because most of the time that's going to...

...just shut the conversation down, especially, I know, within the black community, and we talked about this with Jessicamlin, who runs option, adoption, adoption resource. In the black community, adoption is stigmatized in a lot of ways. Hey, and in many communities, not just the black community but many communities just in general, adoption and foster care are equated with one another. It's like you're saying the same thing. That's what they hear. Now, obviously we know that falster care and adoption or two different things, and we know the differences. But for many of these women you got to think again, in the mindset of a young lady who's scared and got all this chaos going on our life for her to do really in her mind break down the differences. And you try to break down the differences and all this stuff. It's just it's not it's not a realistic scenario that you're going to be able to break all that down. They're going to be able to pass through all of the differences between falster care and adoption and all that stuff. And somebody asked me this is a while back because I talked about how we don't mention adoption. You know, when the new people come out, first thing they say you guys, you've ever thought of mention an adoption offering to adopt their baby? It's like, Oh yeah, he said, but you came along, we never thought of course we thought of that, right, but we don't mention that because it's a conversation stopper and you know you're asking. This is kind of the way I explained it to this one person who said won't you mention adoption? Is You're really asking someone who's going into a place, a mother, the about to do one of the most selfish things she could possibly do to protect herself. Right, all right, by killing her baby. You know, are quotes. Protect herself. That's the mentality a lot of times to handle her situation, to take care of her, to do you. You know she's she's going in to take care of herself. Look out for number one, one of the most selfish things you could do, abortion. And you're asking her to go from that, from abortion, one of the most selfish things you can do, to one of the most selfless things a mom could do, which is place her baby with another family that could take care of her child, and she can't. That's one of those selfless things that a mother can do. Yeah, and you're asking her to go from zero to a thousand, and so it's it's a no go a lot of times. Yeah, also, I will say, develop a relationship, and sometimes that has happened where I remember counseling a woman for months and at the she's almost ready to give birth and at that point she was ready to hear about adoption, interestingly enough, although once the baby was born, she immediately changed back to know she would parent the child. Yeah, which happens a lot. It does, which I will say, and this is you guys, go back and listen to the episode that we did with Jessica Maulan where she talked about this. I think it's a very important episode, yeah, for everyone to listen to, because I've seen people in front of the abortion centers yelling will adopt your baby, will adopt your baby, and they're like wondering why no one's taking them up on that offer. Right, it's because, again, that kind of whole selfishness, selflessness scenario. And then I will say to again, with that stigma about adoption and foster...

...care within the black community and especially at Latrobe, the abortion centers in Charlotte, most of the women that go in our African American most are black women. And when you're out there, upper middle class white person yelling out to a young lady who's black, who you know is really looking at you, is here this upple minute upper middle class white person telling them when you say I'll adopt your baby, you're basically saying, Hey, young black lady, you can't take care of your kid, let me, a rich white person, take care your guys. Like, how's that sound? Right? That's not what we imply yeah, but a lot of time that's what's being heard and we need to understand that. Yeah, and so really, if we are mentioning an option, it's going to be at the tail end of the conversation. It's going to be when all almost they're convinced that abortion is the wrong thing, but they don't really see any other option. They really can't pair at the child. When they can't pair that child, obviously adoption should be an option for them. Right. Yeah, there's ways to do it. There's ministries option adoption is one of those that we connect with that can help make that connection. But something we've learned is that it's definitely not a conversation starter, it's a conversation stopper. Yeah, for sure that. The next point is that your tone matters, and in that that verse that you quoted that really talks about that, because he's spoken a loud voice. Now, I guess loud isn't necessarily tone, but it can be. Yeah, but if you've got an angry, bitter, loud, nasty tone, it again you. This is not going to draw people to you. So if you have self righteous anchor in your heart, as you are, as you're calling out to the women, then that's going to be communicated. That's what they're going to here and they are not going to come and talk to you. So you again, you can say the right thing, not only at the wrong time, but also in with the wrong tone. Yeah, and if you say the right thing with the wrong tone, they don't hear the right thing. What they connect with this the tone. Yeah, absolutely. You can talk about how how bad abortion is, you can talk about you can talk about the resources that are available and do it in an angry, accusatory tone. Tone, you could say something like we have resources available for you and you think about that. Why don't you just come and talk with that? Yeah, everything you need to think about. We have resources available for you once you's come and talk to us. How does that sound? Versus we have resources available for you, would you please just come and talk to us? Like that's more inviting. Right, one tone. I mean just think about just the inflection, just the tone itself. Sounded accusatory. Yeah, when I change it a little bit, same words, it sounded more inviting. Yeah, it's our tone. Yeah, can set the tone, even an angry tone. We would come across as I mean you can say, yeah, say something like this, young lady. Abortion is murder. It destroyed is the life of your baby. Like that sounds to me,...

...you tell me, like a loving way to say you're about to murder your kid. It's giving a pleading, pleading voice, speaking the truth. Yes, opposed to yeah, I mean, if I were to say, and Letty, abortion is murder, why don't you just come and talk to us, you know, it's like yeah, there's like an accusatory tone. Yeah, same words, but the tone and inflection in your voice can mean a lot. Yeah, now I think again, not. We don't want you guys walking on eggshells, always afraid you're going to use the wrong tone. But just being conscious of that, I think our tone actually, you know, Jesus said from the depths of the heart, the mouth speaks. If we show up at the abortion center thinking that we're better than them and that we got it all together and we need to set them straight, that we're the children of God and they're the wicked, and we show up with this attitude of somehow we're better than them rather than an attitude of humility before the Lord, then that will come across in our tone. That's my so important. That we ourselves be before the Lord in prayer, that we are seeking God, that we see the truth of who we are in the side of a holy God, and also, of course, we experience his mercy, his kindness toward us, then we're able to come with mercy and kindness toward others. So I think this, as far as our tone can really be a manifestation of what's in our hearts. And so if you show about the abortion center on a consistent basis and you get an angry tone, you've got an accusatory tone. I think it's time to get in the presence of the Lord and see other's some things in my heart, Lord, that I need to get right with you. I so agree with that. That kind of makes me a little Trie Ei'd because this very morning I was walking along at praying, as I always do on mornings. I actually didn't come to sidewalk, but I thought I would. And and I was remember marine my own abortion past and feeling very weepy, and and and was then thinking I'm grateful to God that he does bring that back, because what it does is it reminds me that I have that in my past. Yeah, and and so the people that I am counseling and calling out to, I can approach them with more compassion. I was thanking God, saying I think this gives me compassion, this ability, much as I don't want to remember it, it does give me the ability to be more compassionate and Hind in kind in my tone. Yeah, you think about the story Jesus gives, and I'm a probably slaughter the story, but you guys know it, where Jesus is talking about two men that went to the temple. One was weeping, wailing and right repenting before the for the Lord. I'm a sinner, don't deserve your mercy, and one is, one was a Publican and one was the Pharisee, or one of the religious guy. It's like he the religious gay. The pharisee praised God. I thank you that I'm not like this,...

...this tax collector, as this guy. Yeah, and I thank you that I'm righteous. And it's like which one of these is justified? It's the one whose heart was broken before the Lord. I. We need to have a heart broken before the Lord for the women. But also even today, like one of the pro boorts came up to me and just said something that was I mean she didn't mean it to be really she didn't mean it to show what was in her heart. I'm not going to go through all what it was because these people are whacked out, so I'm not going to give a more airtime than they need. But it actually broke my heart the way she said it. There was almost like this from her perspective, there was this kind of built into the world, this this need to always like, I don't know, just wish I could spell it out a little more, but explain herself in such a way like I actually have goodness to find her actions being out there in a way. Not that if I could break the story out a little more than I would, but I can't do that. But reality is like what was seen in the story that she was telling, and what she was saying is that she's always paranoid of people doing evil to her, like what a terrible life to live, and I remember living that life. I remember when I was in sane living in rebellion to God none. I couldn't trust any of my friends and still from you. That's stab you in the back, and that's kind of what she was speaking from, just this idea of you can't trust anybody. Yeah, like, man, what a heartbreaking world to live in, right, and US almost are weeping's done out there on and on the sidewalk. Yeah, because of this kind of just I don't know, my heart was was broken, not because I'm so great or anything, but I just realized the world I came from. Yeah, and so I guess this is kind of going a little long on this point that your tone matters, but really from the depths of the heart of the mouth speaks. And if our heart is broken, in our heart is a heart of humility and compassion, because we see what God has brought us from, then that's going to come out of our mouths. Right. So yeah, more than anything, just just keep that in mind. Yeah, and and that goes along with our next point about righteous anger rarely helps the situation there. there. Certainly it's a place for righteous anger out there. What's happening there is a horrific affront to a holy God and rebellion, but it almost never draws people to us. And if our goal is to have them their hearts change towards God and towards those babies, than usually the counterintuitive way to deal with them is with mercy grace and love. Yeah, even in the midst of their anger and even in the midst of their nastiness towards us, which we do see. And again, that's not a natural response. That it's not a natural human response to respond to people being angry with you or persecute your whatever, to respond with love. Yeah, but I think that that is the more effective way, yeah, to respond out there. Yeah, I mean I think there's listen, to be angry is...

...to be human, yeah, and also to be angry in a lot of ways is to be righteous. Yeah, Jesus got angry right. Yeah, it's righteous to be angry with wickedness going on. That's that's true. Yeah, but also the Bible says the anger of Man Does Not work the righteousness of God. So you can have this righteous anger and indignation toward the wickedness that goes on out there. You can have it without it manifesting itself in an angry tone and an angry voice and an angry facial expression. Yeah, you can yield that stuff to the Lord. And, given this volatile situation that being at an abortion center is a lot of times it's hard for you to discern whether or not the anger that you're feeling is righteous anger or carnal anger? Yeah, so let's just put anger on the shelf while we're out there as best we can and let the Lord through us. If God wants to deal with them in an angry way, let him. He can do that in a righteous way every time. God's anger is always righteous, right. God never manifests his anger in an unrageous and unrighteous way. Sadly, often times, our anger that we want to sanitize and calls will call it righteous anger, but in reality it's his carnal anger. Yeah, it's not always righteous. Right, our anger is oftentimes unrighteous. Anger's this anger of the flesh. So I kind of try to take the posture of putting anger on the shelf. Yeah, while I'm out there, let God do the angry stuff. Right, let him deal with him his wrath, and I'll do you're speaking the truth of God, Confronting Evil in a gracious way. So yeah, that's what I would say on that point and prevent hopefully prevented it escalating. Yeah, being really good listeners, even though the reason sometimes that you hear for why they're there are just, frankly, stupid. Oh yeah, they're they're stupid, they're wrong, they're right, evil, wicked. But you still need to listen, and I think the the hard discernment comes in with Listen Long enough to so that they feel heard. Yeah, but not so long that you're allowing them to rationalize and justify what they're about to do. That's a fine balance that I think comes with experience. But along the same lines, smiling, kindness and offering help literally to murderers, people who are intending to murder, is not I think the net are natural way that we would want to respond to someone that we feel is doing something, that we know is doing something that is so awful. Yeah, but again, if they feel that you really do care and you're showing that in your demeanor, in your words, in your tone, it's more likely to bring them to speak to you. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. I mean the reality is we have to knowledge that there is a lot of confusion.

There's a lot of confusion in society, right, and there's a lot of confusion, confusion in the lives of these women. Do they know that they're murdering their child? Many do, right, but there is so much demonic confusion, so much relational confusion, with family members, their boyfriend, friends telling them they should have bore, one friend tell him they shouldn't, all aunt telling them they should, their mom saying you should. You know, all of these things that are spoken people their pastor telling them that God's okay with it or what you know, all these things, all these voices speaking into their lives, are so much confusion there. Yeah, and so do they know they're murdering? Yes, but it's been covered up and it's been all these other voices as have drowned out the voice of truth. So for us just to go out there angry, just with a smirk on our face and just letting them all have it, telling them all they're going to burn in hell, that might be I mean you could justify that biblically, yeah, but is that going to be the effective way to do it and is that going to be the godhonoring way to do it? I don't think so. Yeah, it hasn't been my experience that it's ever effective right. Using the word murderer, I think, is again a showstopper that just going to run away from us. Offering though prayer, sometimes even to the most stony faced, angry people who have said I don't believe in God, I don't want to hear anything about your God. And I have had or seen people just completely turn around with a really heartfelt, sincere prayer and I have not had many say no, please don't pray for me if I offer prayer. But recently this, this did happen just this past week on when someone was on the mobile ultrasound unit and she just was flat affect, wasn't wasn't responding to anything, even seeing her baby on the ultrasound screen. But at the very end she actually said to me, are you going to pray? And I thought at first she was mocking me. Yeah, but I said sure and I started praying and she started crying. It was the first show of emotion I had seen. So I think I've heard you say this before, Daniel, that somewhere in all of our hearts we all know God, we know he's there, we know he's real. That's certainly what the Bible says. All Creation Declares his glory. Yeah, so that none are without excuse. So don't be afraid to offer a sincere prayer. Yeah, and and sometimes I can open doors totally unexpectedly. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, one of my favorites on our points that we mention is don't give up and persistence, persistence, Pace. Sometimes you feel like you're knacking. I excel in this area, as you know. Yes, you have what I call a NAG anointing. That is correct. If I ask you those you are listening to this podcast and you know me. If I ask you to do something and I'm going to ask you to do something, that's you. You helpful to the ministry or whatever. If you don't do that thing,...

...that I will unleash Vickio and your weel see, will have you doing it. She has a Nag annointing, I do, and as so. I had actually a suicidal woman that, through a series of text I thought literally was dead. She had done it, she'd committed suicide, and through the words of a friend, I ended up connecting with the police, who checked on her. She turned out to be alive and she hadn't been the one that it texted me that she was dead. Anyway, I just continued to to persist in that she needed to get help. Yeah, she needed to talk with a suicide hotline. Yeah, and and that, and I continue to text her every single day and she has come around to the point where yesterday she actually she did finally connect with a counselor and she thanks me for will base. Yes, Oh, yes, it's focus on the family. You'll do suicide counseling and and Christian counseling and we'll connect them with local resources. That's what I wanted to happen, was for her to be connected with the local resource. And she kept saying it'll do no good, it'll do no good, and I just would not stop nagging her. And and there is a scripture that I cling to because of this personality traite of mine about I don't know the exact reference, but where the the woman that the judge finally grants which she persisted with it because of the pers is it because she just won't shut up? She won't stop nagging? Generally, it's what that saying. And in the end this woman wrote a text that said I want to thank you for your persistence and I said I like that. where I like that. Are saider than let good work. What Daniel says about me. Yeah, well, I've heard that more than one time. Yeah, I've heard moms that have chosen life. Yeah, I remember one young lady. This is a couple of years ago that chose life, and one of the things that she said she went in and out of the abortion center like five times and every time she came out and every time she went back in, back and forth to her car, someone was calling out to her. And it's kind of counterintuitive because you think, well, after they've already went in and out a couple of times, you need to just leave them along because's just going to tick them off, right, and you're thinking, let him process it. Yeah, which can be the cavy right. Yeah, you led by the Holy Spirit, but for the most part someone is not going to come out of that abortion center and go to their car without being addressed, right, and someone's not going to go back to the abortion center from their car without being addressed. We're going to call out to them. I don't until they tell me to f off right or whatever. I'm gonna be persistent because I've seen it and I know what's going on. I know this fight in their mind, is in their hearts, under the Devil's coming speaking lies you, that age old battle between life and death. It's going on in their mind and their heart, that battle between the flesh and the spirit and you know, we all know that battle. Yeah, that's going on. I want to tip the scale to life right, and so I'm going to keep speaking until again they tell me to blink off. I'm going...

...to keep addressing them because I've seen it break through. One thing that was said right, just was the thing that they were looking for. They were like I've said in the past, these women are grasping for two things. They're grasping for justification to a board and they're grasping for some reason to leave. Yeah, and maybe you being persistent, calling out every time they go in and out. Is that that one thing that they are grasping for will be said? Yeah, and that leads to the last point. We skipped over a few but I don't want this to go too long. We are going to put this bullet point list out with the podcast. But that leads to the last point that, even though you may not perceive it, there is always conflict, there is always conflict in their heart, and know that. Speak to that and don't give up trying to reach that, that kernel of conflict and be able to tip the scale. The scale is it's tipping from one way to another, even if you're not seeing that visibly on their face or their their demeanor, and so don't give up until that baby stead yeah, really. Yeah, the notion that women come to an abortion center and that they have their mind made up that's why they're there, is that? That's false notion. Yeah, women are conflicted. It doesn't matter what their religious, political, whatever persuasion is. There is conflict, even a thread of conflict, if not a bunch of conflict, in their hearts and then their minds, and we want to help that conflict go in the right direction, direction of life and toward the Lord. So right. So keep nagging, keep nagging. If don't give up, keep nagging being snaggingly, nicely, night nack with a correct tone, Yep, and the good time, Yep. Yeah, and Yeah, God's going to use you, guys. Hope this was an encouragement. Hope that we taught you guys something and we hope that you will share this podcast with others. If you have other episodes, other subjects you'd like for us to cover, you can reach out to me, Daniel at Love Life Dot Org. You reach hurt Vicky at Love Life Dot Org. Vicki with a why at the end of it. Love Life Dot Org. We love to hear from you, but until next time, God bless cat. That's you all. Give me our love for love. Give me our love for gratitude. I know it will cost me my life. Nothing's too precious in some you.

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